@mcc Sometimes I do seriously wonder if Firefox is really such a great replacement for Chromium. I mean sure, in like 99% of how it works it's at least better, but there's still lots of stuff that just should not be there. And I'm So. Freaking. Sick. of opt out being a thing. It shouldn't exist. Period. If something affects privacy/etc it should be opt in. Period. I really wish there was more competition in the browser market. I really miss Opera. They were amazing back in the day. 😞

@mcc thank you. I did not know this, and knowing is 1/2 the battle

@mcc Finding any usable web browser is getting increasingly complicated. I'm currently using Vivaldi, Safari, Opera, and DuckDuckGo Browser. However, sometimes I have to install Chromium temporarily on a separate machine because so many people have migrated their firmware updaters to only working with WebUSB, which seems to only actually work in Chromium-based browsers. I evaluate all the browsers with Little Snitch to see if they act shady when I'm not even loading any web pages.

@mcc Annoyingly, the setting doesn't seem to have been added to the Group Policy templates, so there's no way to disable it domain-wide (yet).

@mcc "Chrome— a browser made by an ad company"

i guess you missed it then: Mozilla is an ad company too now. https://blog.mozilla.org/en/mozilla/mozilla-anonym-raising-the-bar-for-privacy-preserving-digital-advertising/

@mcc Thank you so much for posting about this, I'm not sure if I would have heard otherwise.

I have always thought Mozilla's controversial moves in the past have been, for the most part, fairly bone-headed and tone-deaf. But I've also felt they were held to unreasonably higher standards than other browsers by the community.

This, on the other hand, is fucking ridiculous. The bar for "be the least bad browser" is so low. What the fuck.

@mcc
ffs... servo can't become viable soon enough
EDIT: Switching to LibreWolf as i speak, but just like with chromium-based browsers I don't feel good using it...

@mcc

I'm so tired of this.

@mcc

I just checked my Firefox and it hadn't updated yet. I turned off auto update and it asked me if I wanted to cancel, I said yes.

Now to figure out what's next.

@mcc @knightly666 so what the hell am I supposed to use since they're all evil.

@mcc

Not what they should do… yuck…

@mcc

I would pay money for a service that would curate the ads I would get. I don't mind seeing ads that help pay for sites I go to. I hate seeing ads for clearly garbage products or for products I have zero interest in. I haven't been on a vacation in nearly 40 years. I don't plan on going on a vacation ever again. I hate travelling. Stop trying to get me to go on a week-long cruise. That sounds like torture.

@mcc The feature is currently only for specific providers. And probably more importantly is -completely- different from Chrome's, featuring -far- less information. Unlike Chrome's feature for example, advertisers know nothing about who the likely user of the browser is.

See more technical details here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KpdSKD8-Rn0bWPTu4UtK54ks0yv2j22pA5SrAD9av4s

Edit: I incorrectly stated this was not on release yet.

@mcc
Mozilla would be a lot easier organization to like if they, you know, ever managed to stop shooting themselves

@mcc

Thanks for the note. Yep, they'd checked it for me. Sigh.

@mcc ooh. Thanks for the heads-up.

@mcc does this exist in the FF android app? I checked my settings and can't find it.

@mcc
It doesn't look like that box has appeared yet in the Android version of 128, but I'll have to keep an eye out...

@mcc
Every time Firefox (or Thunderbird) gets an update, I go to their What's New page to see the changes.
I saw this new "feature" and promptly disabled it. I also tooted about it, but I have few followers.
Firefox has a tiny user base by comparison to Chrome - and much of their funding comes from.....Google! They need new revenue streams or they will disappear and this new "feature" is one way of getting that.
The fact that it was made "opt-out" instead of "opt-in" is the main issue here.

@mcc The way it works, if you are using an ad blocker, there are no ads to see or click on. It won't be collecting data or sending anything to an aggregator. But this thing should be off by default. Even so, there is no reason for it to send anything about site visitors. Who clicks or buys something is not part of an aggregator system. Just that it happened on a subscribed site, & they can't trust the sites. It used to be intrusive for that reason. This method is an improvement, fwiw.

@mcc Firefox is 98% funded by Google/Alphabet

@mcc@mastodon.social I know this is a minor issue compared to the feature itself, but the acronym for the new feature is "PPA" so search results for "Firefox PPA" (Ubuntu's Personal Package Archive) will forever be tainted.

@mcc Well that just sucks! Thanks for the Heads up...

@mcc thanks for the heads up!

@mcc
Mozilla Foundation can keep pretenting that it is saviour of the internet.
Mozilla Corporation killed its only product anyone even cared about.
Good bye Mozilla
@mozilla

@mcc oh jeepers. What genius was in charge of this. They making it hard for me to like them.

@mcc this isn't in my Android Firefox stable yet, but I just noticed it in the latest Nightly build.

Settings > Data collection > turn off "Marketing data"

Also, my enhanced tracking protection has been dropped from strict to default at some point.

Also, I guess Nightly is introducing a new Safari ish button bar, separate from the address bar. Ugh.

@mcc Mozilla has always been scummy so I'm not surprised. They're just not as good at it as Google so it doesn't show.

For example, they make it look like you can donate to the foundation to give money to Firefox. In reality, it's not possible to donate to Firefox directly and it's not developed by the foundation but the corporation. Donations to the foundation are instead spent on bullshit side projects and political donations as well as paying a shit ton of money to the CEO even though they're bleeding users.

@mcc thank you, firefox had updated recently and I didn't know about this setting.

It's now turned off!

@mcc We really need way more alternative browser engines, not just servo and ladybird... and hope that some of them get big enough to repeal the hostile takeover of the standards by WHATWG in order to make them "living" (Read: The opposite of standards, but kinda, sorta documenting what the big players have already implemented; Making it impossible to ever catch up). I'm in the full throes of a huge autistic burnout, otherwise I'd give it a shot myself :-(

@mcc well, it's privacy preserving, right? just kidding lol, obviously turned it off as soon as I found it. Still, from the technical writing regarding this, it could indeed be a much better way of having ads, if the industry insists bullishly on having them that is. Better these than actually tracking ads, but better no ads than any ads

@mcc for fuck's sake. I honestly couldn't believe this was true, until I looked in the settings to see for myself

@mcc at this point I'm just hopeful that they can fund themselves enough to stay in the game. Do whatever you must, @firefox@mozilla.social, I'll just use @librewolf

@mcc
Is this also enabled on Firefox on Android? And how can i disable that as about:config is not available on Firefox on Android?

@mcc puh! My firefox is updating, I'll get to that right away, when it's ready.

Thank you so much for your warning! 😽

@mcc

@mozilla WHAT THE <AD-SERVER> were you thinking?

This is insane. Do you really want to loose all your remaining users?

I am SO close to stop using your browser.

You are becoming the same people you depised before.

@mcc @mozilla Thank you not...

@mcc
I have noticed it while I tested out my new Website with Firefox, Opera and my main Browser Safari. I deinstalled Firefox right away and kept Opera as an option on my mac. Chrome will never be on my devices. My first choice remains Safari because no other browser does care more about user protection.

@mcc Apple pulled a similar stunt with the Orwellian “privacy preserving ad measurement”, also enabled by default without asking, yet people still think Apple is a friend of privacy:

https://macreports.com/what-is-privacy-preserving-ad-measurement-turn-off-or-on/

@mcc Thanks for bringing this to my attention - absolutely no indication from Firefox that they had brought this in. Shame as had moved to Firefox specifically as a reaction to Chrome privacy and ad policies.

@mcc I don't think this refers to Google's proposal, but instead to a pilot with standards from the Private Advertising Technology group at the W3C.

https://github.com/mozilla/explainers/tree/main/ppa-experiment

Of course, you still may turn it off :-) but it's a different approach from that in Chrome AFAIK, and has IMHO a better (not monopolistic) approach to Web advertising.

(That's not my endorsement of Web advertising, I turned the feature off myself.)

@mcc
We have to liberate Firefox from MozCorp

@mcc jesus i didn't even fucking know that was a thing, thanks for reminding me to check and turn it off. seriously i thought firefox was the browser for privacy minded tech nerds who like to block ads and know that their browser won't disobey their wishes, but it turns out it's just as shit as Chrome in some regards!

@mcc Not stable yet, afaik, but I may give Ladybird a shot.

@mcc Thank you for the information. It’s insane that I have to learn about this change by randomly stumbling across a social media post. And yep, it was enabled by default

@mcc@mastodon.social

Thanks for the warning. At least it's not hidden in the "about:config" thingy. 😉

@mcc
I don't have this in my firefox yet. Do you happen to know if users can pre-emptively set the setting to off before the upgrade?

@mcc @ParadeGrotesque https://ap.nil.im/notice/AjlRMeaBKgpJCQbAAq

@mcc
Microsoft users: First time?

@mcc @catsalad Welcome to the Safari club.

@mcc There is also a feedback post here: https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/discussions/remove-quot-privacy-preserving-attribution-quot-ad-measurement/m-p/61874

@mcc thanks for the hint, disabled it, too

@mcc I hope (and believe) that @librewolf shields me from this crap.

@mcc Thanks to your warning, I checked my settings before and after updating so I saw this setting appear - TURNED ON WITHOUT PERMISSION - the moment I updated to the latest version of Firefox. Bad job, Firefox.

@mcc Time to switch to LibreWolf.

@mcc Found it. Turned it off. Thank you.

@mcc Safari also has it, it is enabled by default, and in my opinion their implementation is worse in some aspects (though it's all about compromises here).

@mcc Thanks for spreading awareness of this. I found out a few days ago and unchecked mine.

@mcc Firefox always feels to me like if you didn't want to run Windows but the only Linux distro there was was Ubuntu. (Waterfox is a thing though and that's my daily driver.)

@mcc it seriously sucks that they figure this is the only way to make money if Google can’t give them money anymore

@mcc I'm still running 127 but has two family membres change this on their 128 updates.

@mcc @dgoldsmith Thank you for sharing this

@mcc Have Firefox v.128 and it does NOT have this. The page is completely different.

@mcc Note: it can be found in about:preferences#privacy .

@mcc

FWIW this isn't yet in the ESR version.

(Extended Support Release, targeted at corporations but better for everybody who doesn't want rapid changes.)

I would recommend switching to the ESR version, as a temporary step to buy time while you figure out the longer-term plan *EXCEPT* (big but!) there's a huge problem with that measure.

+

@mcc Thank you for this PSA. I wonder if this "feature" is mitigated by Pi-hole or ublock origin? Should I continue with Firefox? I there a more trustworthy browser? #pihole #firefox #cantTrustAnyone

@mcc@mastodon.ggsocial @brainblasted I'm still looking for blog posts listing options that Mozilla didn't try to diversify their funding. I just think I'm part of the problem for I haven't found one yet, without having to resort to a search engine.

@mcc to make it even worse, they're actively hiding this feature by excluding it from Settings search results :\

@mcc @jpm Surprising that Chrome did a better job letting users know about it than Firefox. I expected more from Firefox.

@mcc

@mcc it really sucks that you said (without tagging that it's a joke) that Chrome is better than Firefox, this is not helpful to people who take things literally, and a lot of people in Mastodon are autistic (including me) and it took a lot of scrolling for me to realize that's what was happening in this thread.

@mcc But, but ,but it's an experimental feature, how can they know if it will work if they don't entrap everybody

@mcc To me the option is also worded in a weird way. Like if I disallow sites to perform "privacy preserving ad measurements", do they then get to perform privacy invasive ad measurements?

@mcc
Well, I have Firefox 128.0 and checked. The setting is there, but it wasn't turned on...

@mcc

many thanks for the helpful information.

@mcc librewolf?

@mcc
I use Vivaldi. I haven't tried their email yet, but the browser works as advertised. I've been using it for a couple of years now. I'm not saying it's better, but it is a lot safer. I have it on Windows, Ubuntu, and Android. Using it on Linux avoids the AI mess. https://vivaldi.com/

@mcc Hmmm. I'm a ff user and I certainly did not turn this feature off but I've just checked and box is not checked. ff 115.13.0 for mac.

@mcc Thanks a lot for the heads-up. It's now turned off but WTAF #Mozilla ?