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Darius Kazemi

Extremely happy to announce that @kissane and I have been funded by @DigInfFund to run a project called Fediverse Governance Successes & Gaps!

We will look at the people, software, and processes of the Fediverse, and make strong recommendations for how open source projects, philanthropic funders, civil society organizations, and others can co-create a Fediverse that is safer and better for humanity than the social media we've been stuck with for decades.

More here:

tinysubversions.com/notes/ford

56 comments
erin sparling

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund wow what an awesome future you two will bring! I can’t wait.

Erik Moeller

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund I can't think of two people better qualified for this endeavor. Congratulations! Very much looking forward to the results.

wakest ⁂

@darius @DigInfFund @kissane oh damn thats awesome news! congratulations to both of you I cant wait to see what comes of this

Clayton Dewey

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund this is huge!!!

I recently facilitated a discussion at the Nonprofit Software Development Summit with Fediverse users and the quality of governance was the biggest determinant of whether people had had a good experience or not on Mastodon and other Fediverse platforms.

Erin Kissane

@clayton @darius That seems extremely relevant! I’d love to hear more as we get going.

joanne mcneil

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund two brilliant and kind people. what an incredible team. excited for you both!!

Prof Prachi Srivastava

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund

Congratulations! Seems like a very useful and interesting project.

Joan Westenberg

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund congrats! This is important work - now more than ever. And it looks like it's in some capable hands. Onwards.

Ahmet Alphan SabancΔ±

@darius @kissane that’s amazing news! Congratulations to both of you!

Boud

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund

Why ignore the small instances [1]? The power law slope of the instance size distribution evolved
from -0.55 on 21 Nov 2022 to -0.47 on 15 Oct 2023 [2]. There are many more small instances than big ones, and the system *has* been evolving to weaken centralisation.

Adding a random sample of small instances would better represent the aim of decentralisation.

[1] codeberg.org/boud/fedistats_na

[2] codeberg.org/boud/fedistats_na

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund

Why ignore the small instances [1]? The power law slope of the instance size distribution evolved
from -0.55 on 21 Nov 2022 to -0.47 on 15 Oct 2023 [2]. There are many more small instances than big ones, and the system *has* been evolving to weaken centralisation.

Adding a random sample of small instances would better represent the aim of decentralisation.

Darius Kazemi

@boud we chose our scope because we do not have unlimited resources

Julien Colomb

@darius @boud

no one has unlimited resources of course, but this is a sampling question. One has to make choices, and the question was about why you made the choice to reduce your analysis on medium and large size instances.

Indeed, If there are 10 000 small instances and 1 very huge one, why are you choosing to interview the huge one ?

It is impossible to prevent sample bias when planning interviews, but this one seems unnecessary ?

Boud

@darius

Assuming that "medium" is logarithmic, i.e. about 1000 or so users, there are a few hundreds of these - so you presumably intend to subsample these medium-sized instances, e.g. aim at 10-20 interviews.

Splitting up into e.g. 5-10 medium and 5-10 small instances would increase the sample error and bias, as @jcolomb said, but also increase the chance of better studying all scales: big + medium + small.

The risk of the big crushing the small seems like a significant governance question.

Joni Fieggen

@boud @darius @jcolomb I would also argue that a β€˜medium and large’ runs a significant risk of skewing heavily white, and mostly male.

Plus the fact that it’s folks from the US, with US money, on a network that for once isn’t as dominated by American interests and governance as almost everything that came before.

Darius Kazemi

@mejofi @boud @jcolomb It just occurred to me that we might not be talking on similar terms here: for me the break point for "medium" is about 150 people, where it is unlikely for everyone to know everyone else. Because to me that is a place where governance mechanisms become necessary rather than just a good idea. I talk about this in runyourown.social

Re: the American thing, it's a valid criticism and I am trying to be mindful of my biases. We want an international sample for sure.

Joni Fieggen

@darius @boud @jcolomb I would still be wary of excluding BIPOC folks that way, though, so I’d argue that you should probably be correcting for that in a parallel track that doesn’t select based on instance size. As in, also talk to folks on Black-run instances, for example, even if they are small.

Joni Fieggen

@darius @boud @jcolomb Might not be a bad idea to be explicit about this in both of your posts on this topic πŸ™‚

Erin Kissane

@jcolomb @darius @boud We’re focusing on governance models, rather than eg software, so we're also choosing primary subjects who work at or beyond a minimum level of complexity. (An instance for 15 friends *should* have minor risks and governance challenges, though there are outliersβ€”and huge instances are their own kind of beast.)

By the time we begin work in 2024, we'll have "medium" more narrowly defined, but I expect wide variety in size.

Syfer πŸ”’βš‘ Shock

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund The fediverse consists of overly-complex cruft bundles that discovered the most byzantine, memory-hogging, and CPU roasting, and complex ways for shuttling text messages. The servers are mountainous piles of power suckage and bloat. The current logic of sharing and caching the content uses more bandwidth than a bandwidth machine.

Not one project has bothered to create a material design UX that makes any sense for a efficient workflow. Everyone has confused "stylish" and "pretty" with "useful." If you designed an email client for a fortune 500 company that looked like Mastodon the company would sue you for their money back.

If you want a safe and productive "fediverse" then tell everyone to stop being prima donnas and focus on building one server platform that uses ONE AND ONLY one stable, compiled programming language (C99 or C11 or a Wirthian language, of course, or possbily even Go) and uses ONLY that one language and NOTHING ELSE.

No node, no python, no ruby, no rust, no boutique languages like scheme, lisp, haskell, et al but an old school language that has passed the test of many decades of systems usage.

Remove all JavaScript from the web front ends and instead of asynchronous polling with JavaScript and web sockets and all that fluff just use CSS-styled iframes and meta-refresh and html forms in the frames.

Use envelope encryption on all direct messages so they are end-to-end encrypted not just between the servers but between the user client applications.

Ditch JSON and all its variants completely and just use plain text files with lines of text as key:pair data entries. Text parsed by lines is simpler, requiring less overhead to parse data. Language compilers already have the line logic built in when reading files in text mode.

Use server signatures to sign hashes of remote content instead of caching remote content on the user server. Enforce this. That way the client will request content from the server pointed to in the signed hash.

Here's to a bloat-free, JavaScript free, Erlang free, safe 'fediverse'.

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund The fediverse consists of overly-complex cruft bundles that discovered the most byzantine, memory-hogging, and CPU roasting, and complex ways for shuttling text messages. The servers are mountainous piles of power suckage and bloat. The current logic of sharing and caching the content uses more bandwidth than a bandwidth machine.

Michael Foster

@darius Great news! Going to be really interesting to see the results

jane

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund what a powerful combo of people! so excited for yall!

Sindarina, Edge Case Detective

@darius How do you plan to account for your inherent biases, such as being two Americans, with American funding, limiting yourselves to medium and large instances only, even though that's not where most of the fediverse is, as a network? πŸ€”

Darius Kazemi

@sindarina perhaps I should say that to me, a medium-sized server is something bigger than about 150 people, essentially one where it is not likely for everyone to know everyone else. To me this is the point where governance begins to really matter. I don't know if that changes how you feel.

As to the American thing, it's a valid concern. I try to take a global perspective in what I do, and to ensure that my sample is not just US or English-speaking servers.

Sindarina, Edge Case Detective

@darius Hmm, OK. We’ll see what it looks like when you're done, I guess πŸ˜„

Julian Lam

This is fantastic news, I am so excited to hear about new #funding initiatives to further the open web and the critical infrastructure that underpins it.

For so long we've had innovation in this space funded by silicon valley money and incentives, and it's high time somebody stood up and said that model isn't working for the common person.

@darius @kissane @DigInfFund

lown

@darius @kissane Really, really exciting, well done both. Can't wait to read it.

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