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Top-level
 @flying_saucers @drizzy I would disagree. Wanting to ship something out of the box doesn't mean having the customer pay for the Windows License without knowing, and not giving them any other options at purchase. This isn't about wanting to ship an OS, I get that, it's about not offering any other option than Windows (most companies). It's the reason that I think Linux in retail stores is important. 8 comments
@flying_saucers Other than that, there is companies like System76 or Tuxedo, but they're much more niche than something like Lenovo or Dell. I find it somewhat unfair. Especially because the Windows EULA tells you your license can be refunded at the manufacturer, and most manufacturers upon asking tell you to ask Microsoft support.   @flying_saucers Dell has their shitty "recommends windows" propaganda to make people believe their computers will somehow "perform better" is they use windows. HP used to sell laptops without windows, eitheir freeDOS (so no micro$oft tax) or Suse, which just feels… too "corporate-setup wonblows" 😬 Not sure if that's still true. And some HP laptops are much shittier than others… Lenovo is what I have for work, running Debian. Hardware is over-priced and sucks, their USB C [.…] @flying_saucers docks suck. DisplayLink protocol (not to be confused with DisplayPort and not Lenovo-specific) suck… If it means giving money to fund Micro$oft's propaganda through Dell, of buying over-priced shitty hardware… No thanks. And then, what distro with they use? Some bloated Ubuntu with their own "apps" and trackers like windows and android? and charge for it "See, we offer a Linux option, you have no reason to ask for unlocked UEFI/bootloader"… Again, no thanks. @flying_saucers There's no need for having bloated "Linux". It would only convince people it's OK to have locked hardware over which they have 0 control. BUT buying hardware without micro$oft tax, nor stupid hardware locks, should be possible… Just because some people want computers that crash into black/blue screen on the first startup and have to troubleshooter once a week, doesn't mean everyone should pay for ripoffware they don't need and won't use. @Rush @flying_saucers I agree it's important, but in the context of EU policies how would that look like? The only realistic way I see is forcing easy options to buy without OS or easy way to refund. Because you can't force Linux by policy. Then there'd be cries FreeBSD was left out etc. @drizzy @Rush that's a tricky one. What are the possible options? Here's some ideas 1) Force no OS, have customers install it themselves -> not consumer friendly, increases barrier to technology |
Gregory's Server
@Rush @drizzy that's fair. I did a quick survey and the only popular computer companies I could find offering Linux out of the box are Dell and Lenovo, and something tells me no retail chain carries those products. So point conceded, the choice is being made unnecessarily difficult.