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Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:'s posts Post Back to profile
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mdn
38 comments
m0xEE replied to mdn

@mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki @iska I see.
That's a bit different IMO. Data mining on a global scale is a major issue, but there is no way to fix it on a personal scale. And it is wrong to even try. Because even if you do you best to prevent collection of your data, they do it indirectly. The only way to fix it completely is to avoid contacting other people, that's paranoid.
Such activities should be hindered by law, what Facebook and Google do shouldn't be a viable bussiness model.

23 Jul 2022 at 9:01 | Open on social.librem.one
Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix: replied to m0xEE

@m0xee @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki

"preventing spying requires some effort so it's better to give up"

the only nonfree programs that run on my computers are "firmware" they won't run without (which I try to fix); and I'm not lonely.

23 Jul 2022 at 9:11 | Open on mstdn.starnix.network
m0xEE replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:

@iska @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki
"preventing spying requires some effort so it's better to give up"
Wrong!
You not playing this game won't fix corporate surveillance, the only thing you'll likely achieve — you'll miss good old fun, that's it. Your friend will think you're a weirdo and eventually you'll become a full-time weirdo. If you don't want to play — don't, corporate surveillance shouldn't affect your decision. You just don't fight it with something like this.

23 Jul 2022 at 9:41 | Open on social.librem.one
Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix: replied to m0xEE

@m0xee @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki

Wrong!

But this is what you're saying :gyate_marisa_confused:​

You not playing this game won't fix corporate surveillance

It's not just refusal but advocacy against it and promotion of freedom.
Besides, just saying no makes a difference.

corporate surveillance shouldn't affect your decision.

Because surveillance shouldn't exist; yet it does and affects our daily lives.
Like the corpos getting richer, data getting leaked or one's plans being changed based on algorithm's decision.

@m0xee @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki

Wrong!

But this is what you're saying :gyate_marisa_confused:​

You not playing this game won't fix corporate surveillance

It's not just refusal but advocacy against it and promotion of freedom.
Besides, just saying no makes a difference.

corporate surveillance shouldn't affect your decision.

23 Jul 2022 at 9:53 | Open on mstdn.starnix.network
Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix: replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:

@m0xee @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki

Do you think I'm a weirdo?

(honestly, you're weirder for being such a reply guy - who barely posts himself.)

23 Jul 2022 at 9:56 | Open on mstdn.starnix.network
thatguyoverthere ن replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:
Your all weirdos or you'd be on twitter lol
23 Jul 2022 at 10:01 | Open on charlestown.social
m0xEE replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:

@iska @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki Fedi is a bunch of weirdos! 🤣
Not that it's bad…
>being such a reply guy - who barely posts himself
That's not weird, that is idiosyncratic!

23 Jul 2022 at 10:17 | Open on social.librem.one
m0xEE replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:

@iska @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki
> Besides, just saying no makes a difference.
No, it doesn't. There is an extremely slim chance that you'll kill an elephant throwing corn seeds at it, but that is not what you usually do if you want to succeed. Issue can't be fixed on personal level, you have to do more than that. Make your own company that respects privacy and make your products successful, become an activist and get privacy law passed. Excluding yourself by not playing games won't do shit.

23 Jul 2022 at 10:12 | Open on social.librem.one
Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix: replied to m0xEE

@m0xee @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki

There is an extremely slim chance that you'll kill an elephant throwing corn seeds at it

Peer pressure is a big reason for proprietary software usage, you've mentioned it before.

Are you saying I should give up freedom and privacy for a bit of fun? That I should give up if I don't think at politicians' scale?

I won't kill microsoft by tomorrow, obviously; but if someone joins, there's going to be 2 seed-throwing people instead of one, and that could spread quickly.

@m0xee @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki

There is an extremely slim chance that you'll kill an elephant throwing corn seeds at it

Peer pressure is a big reason for proprietary software usage, you've mentioned it before.

Are you saying I should give up freedom and privacy for a bit of fun? That I should give up if I don't think at politicians' scale?

23 Jul 2022 at 11:07 | Open on mstdn.starnix.network
Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix: replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:
pyrate replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:
@iska @m0xee @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki An entity like Microsoft simply has too much insurance, they are literally able to buy their way out of problems.

This would include the userbase completely flipping to using linux on end user production environments. Microsoft has already laid its hooks into various linux projects.

I've been about the freedom and privacy thing, but its highly inconvenient for the average person - "who has nothing to hide" It's easy for them to ask the 'why' which concludes with 'idgaf.'

In a way, I do envy Russians - M$ has been forced to completely sever services which now forces all Russians to become acquainted with Linux.
@iska @m0xee @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki An entity like Microsoft simply has too much insurance, they are literally able to buy their way out of problems.

This would include the userbase completely flipping to using linux on end user production environments. Microsoft has already laid its hooks into various linux projects.
23 Jul 2022 at 11:38 | Open on poa.st
Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix: replied to pyrate

@pyrate @Suiseiseki @mangeurdenuage @m0xee

Many Russians just keep using win, one reason is that they didn't pay for it anyway;
Others will pay fortune for macs because "it's easier"

We need GNU/Linux advertisements.

23 Jul 2022 at 11:58 | Open on mstdn.starnix.network
MattZ replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:
Alright, first is to pick the demographic and target the ads according to their needs.

Make a presentation on it and join after that.
23 Jul 2022 at 12:26 | Open on gleasonator.com
Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix: replied to MattZ

@colinsmatt11 @Suiseiseki @pyrate @mangeurdenuage @m0xee

First patriotism/anti-USA, then business and ease of use, then cover more about freedom, privacy and security.

Free software benefits everyone.

23 Jul 2022 at 12:49 | Open on mstdn.starnix.network
m0xEE replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:

@iska @colinsmatt11 @Suiseiseki @pyrate @mangeurdenuage Why don't we appeal to conspiracy theorists instead?
"Did you know that your tinfoil hat is no longer enough?!"
"Nanochips in the vaccine will dissolve if you use Pine Time! And it' only $10000"
It worked with Alex Jones' dick pills, why not? 🤣

23 Jul 2022 at 12:56 | Open on social.librem.one
翠星石 replied to m0xEE
@m0xee >"Did you know that your tinfoil hat is no longer enough?!"
Tinfoil nor Aluminum was never enough from the very start.
Testing has shown that Aluminum foil hats enhance government frequencies rather than reduce them.
To get the intended effect, you need a lead foil hat which is also grounded.
23 Jul 2022 at 13:17 | Open on freesoftwareextremist.com
Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix: replied to 翠星石

@Suiseiseki @m0xee

I just don't go outside, government can't get me in my GNU/kOBSD-libre basement!

23 Jul 2022 at 14:04 | Open on mstdn.starnix.network
m0xEE replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:

@iska @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki
> there's going to be 2 seed-throwing people instead of one
No, there won't be. Because by excluding yourself you are just weirding people out. If someone is dissatisfied with Google and you tell him to port PmOS to his phone and self-host his mail he will tell you to go to hell. But if you show him/her AOSP or Fairphone and Protonmail it might work. These companies might become evil, but today they are better alternatives and require little effort to switch.

23 Jul 2022 at 11:55 | Open on social.librem.one
Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix: replied to m0xEE

@m0xee @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki

If someone is dissatisfied with Google and you tell him to port PmOS to his phone and self-host his mail he will tell you to go to hell.

That's a huge strawman, I've never said such thing.

23 Jul 2022 at 11:58 | Open on mstdn.starnix.network
m0xEE replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:

@iska @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki
I know, that is why I used "if". It was just an example of overdoing it instead of doing things gradually.

23 Jul 2022 at 12:44 | Open on social.librem.one
翠星石 replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:
@iska I can throw something far heftier than seeds at the enemies of freedom.
23 Jul 2022 at 13:09 | Open on freesoftwareextremist.com
m0xEE replied to 翠星石

@Suiseiseki @iska
I'm afraid bell peppers won't cut it, better get one of those cool melon catapults. Even if you can't kill the elephant, you can feed it!
23 Jul 2022 at 13:55 | Open on social.librem.one
翠星石 replied to m0xEE
@m0xee Wait till you see the bell pepper stuffing.
23 Jul 2022 at 13:58 | Open on freesoftwareextremist.com
CyberSpook🇷🇺 replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:
@iska
Why care about long-term consequences if you can get drunk and high on cocaine every day?
@m0xee @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki
23 Jul 2022 at 22:33 | Open on soc.redeyes.site
mdn replied to m0xEE
@m0xee @iska @Suiseiseki
>Excluding yourself by not playing games won't do shit.
"If you give data to the data eating monster it won't feed it"
I wonder who's behind such posts :Thinker:
23 Jul 2022 at 11:27 | Open on shitposter.club
mdn replied to m0xEE
@m0xee @Suiseiseki @iska
>but there is no way to fix it on a personal scale
-Stop using proprietary software, simple as.
-Stop using proprietary hardware, not simple as.

>And it is wrong to even try.
:doubt:

>The only way to fix it
Is to not use proprietary centralized software/services.

>Because even if you do you best to prevent collection of your data, they do it indirectly.
What are metadata.jpg
They are already doing it, regardless of choice, we can only mitigate to certain levels or stop using everything.

>that's paranoid.
Yeah because obviously continuing using proprietary software to not look paranoid worked so well on the population :honk:

>should be hindered by law
It's already the case in some countries but:
-proprietary software conceals functions of the software
-laws are often lobbied and aren't effective or less effective
@m0xee @Suiseiseki @iska
>but there is no way to fix it on a personal scale
-Stop using proprietary software, simple as.
-Stop using proprietary hardware, not simple as.
23 Jul 2022 at 11:19 | Open on shitposter.club
m0xEE replied to mdn

@mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki @iska
> Yeah because obviously continuing using proprietary software to not look paranoid worked so well on the population
Guess what? Not using it didn't work either! You know what actually made a difference? Making better alternatives available and informing people. "Not using" doesn't change anything at all, it only excludes you and diverts your attention from bigger picture to micromanaging your life without these things.

23 Jul 2022 at 11:41 | Open on social.librem.one
m0xEE replied to m0xEE

@mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki @iska
> It's already the case in some countries but:
That is right. It wasn't "Not using" that made MS remove IE in EU edition of Windows. And we have these nice "Reject all" buttons on nearly every website not because we were "not using". Firefox didn't appear out of thin air of "not using". Of course a lot more has to be done, but not having fun playing some game because it has some fscked up "anti-cheat" measures is not it.

23 Jul 2022 at 11:46 | Open on social.librem.one
mdn replied to m0xEE
@m0xee @Suiseiseki @iska
>And we have these nice "Reject all" buttons
Legal protection isn't direct protection.
You can't prove it works because you aren't the administrator of the server, and you don't/can't read the code that is injected in your web browser.
I agree that it's necessary to insure possible cohesion in groups yes, but they don't provide real direct protection, it's just a"just trust me, lol" move in the case of proprietary software.
And like I said earlier before laws are lobbied, if you have read the EU GDPR you must have seen that these rulings aren't effective as people think they are because there's a lot of loopholes in the said text, and besides loopholes most of the time when people reject their data usage it's for targeting commercial/marketing usage, not for AI analysis and the likes, which is also specified in the GDPR but not mandatory.

> because it has some fscked up "anti-cheat" measures is not it.
These anti cheat are actual backdoors to your computer, they filter and monitor want you can and can't do, how do you think they work ? That's what a DRM his.
@m0xee @Suiseiseki @iska
>And we have these nice "Reject all" buttons
Legal protection isn't direct protection.
You can't prove it works because you aren't the administrator of the server, and you don't/can't read the code that is injected in your web browser.
23 Jul 2022 at 12:07 | Open on shitposter.club
m0xEE replied to mdn

@mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki @iska
> they don't provide real direct protection
That's true! So both are important. My point was that not using proprietary solutions on its own is ineffective. You've got to have some alternative that's actually usable. And of course you've got to keep "tech" companies in line. Why do they even call them tech companies? Apple and MS at least sell tech, Google — to some extent. Facebook doesn't sell any tech, it sells your data, it's a surveillance company.

23 Jul 2022 at 12:19 | Open on social.librem.one
mdn replied to m0xEE
@m0xee @Suiseiseki @iska
>So both are important.
I agree. But you have to be pragmatic about it, one side you are sure that you are protected the other side is just a promise.

>that not using proprietary solutions on its own is ineffective
I disagree.

>You've got to have some alternative that's actually usable
And we have them.

>Apple and MS at least sell tech
They don't sell anything, when you read their EULA you will learn that they give you a temporary revocable authorization of usage of their Services as a software.

>to some extent. Facebook doesn't sell any tech
They provide a service free of charge in exchange of your private data.

>it's a surveillance company.
Same as Microsoft and Apple, like all proprietary software entities.
@m0xee @Suiseiseki @iska
>So both are important.
I agree. But you have to be pragmatic about it, one side you are sure that you are protected the other side is just a promise.
23 Jul 2022 at 12:25 | Open on shitposter.club
m0xEE replied to mdn

@mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki @iska
> they give you a temporary revocable authorization of usage of their Services
Oh, I think they are different because they sell hardware 😂
Apple does, so does MS: Xbox and Surface things. For Google this part of their bussiness is near negligent, but they still have it. There were some talks of "Facebook-phone", but I believe it didn't come to fruition — so pure surveillance there.

23 Jul 2022 at 12:30 | Open on social.librem.one
mdn replied to m0xEE
@m0xee @Suiseiseki @iska
>Apple does, so does MS: Xbox and Surface things
It's the "intellectual property" of these entities as stated in the EULA you aren't allowed to go outside the box.
That doesn't mean people don't do it, but legally speaking you don't own it, you paid a for a physical object on which you legally have no rights beside a temporary revocable permit of usage.
@m0xee @Suiseiseki @iska
>Apple does, so does MS: Xbox and Surface things
It's the "intellectual property" of these entities as stated in the EULA you aren't allowed to go outside the box.
23 Jul 2022 at 12:33 | Open on shitposter.club
Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix: replied to m0xEE

@m0xee @mangeurdenuage @Suiseiseki

making better alternatives

The GNU/Linux desktop is already there. Office, pictures, music, printing and even device support have been in good state for years.
We only need to persuade people in joining.

Also, "alternatives" implies you'd want to give up your freedom in the first place...

23 Jul 2022 at 11:48 | Open on mstdn.starnix.network
mdn replied to Iska :emacs_thinking:​ :guix:
@iska @m0xee @Suiseiseki
>We only need to persuade people in joining.
There's also a need to have hardware manufacturers to release their drivers/firmwares under GPLv3.
Hardware support is getting harder and harder due to background agreements with microsoft, or other inane laws see:
https://media.libreplanet.org/mgoblin_media/media_entries/1529/144_7_gerwith.webm
@iska @m0xee @Suiseiseki
>We only need to persuade people in joining.
There's also a need to have hardware manufacturers to release their drivers/firmwares under GPLv3.
23 Jul 2022 at 12:10 | Open on shitposter.club
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