@rauschma Thanks for all your contributions. What would be really useful is to have a very basic algorithm that places the posts with the most boost by the ones *you* follow at the top, and to make it one of the default options, particularly for the new users. Not having any algorithm whatsoever is probably the reason many of my colleagues became completely inactive.

@rauschma HTML is not programming☝️ *scnr* ;)

@rauschma I think the results are accurate but also skewed due to your base of followers.

As someone who volunteers at an Apple User Group of mostly older people, there is very little chance they would make it through the mastodon signup or at the best end up on social. But asking the question is likely to turn them away as being too complicated.

@rauschma Thank you for all your work and especially for working on quote posts!

@rauschma Would be interesting to ask this in a very non-tech bubble or even people who want to leave because they find it "complicated".

I'm working with social media (tried all channels) professionally and think: It's not so much the tech aspect (you can learn that quickly/good apps) but the problem that big algorithmic platforms have us brainwashed. The problem is rather to completely unthink such a system, to understand that M is different - and what opportunities it has.
The 2nd problem

@rauschma
There are other IT professionals who don't program.

@rauschma
Judging from my experience, it's often explained waaays too techy and thus too complicated.

@rauschma Where's "normal user who dislikes 'tech' and hates coding"

@rauschma I don't think I fall in the bottom/first category (hubby places me there, fyi), but I don't really fit in #2 either.

I'm pretty savvy with internet stuff, but I don't know any code (once upon a time I did some really bare bones html).

Where is category 1.5? lol. I guess I'll put myself in #2, but also, if you want to chat with someone who is not representative of most of Mastodon (tech speaking), I'm happy to chat. I'm pretty sure I'm an outlier.

@rauschma Normal user, i.e., I can use pretty much any app if I RTFM, and understand how things work *in terms of user interface*. I know nothing about what goes on under the hood, though I assume it involves tiny elves.

I did not find it difficult at all to get up and running on Masto or to use it.

Is it tricky to set up one’s own servers or instance or whatever? Or to custom-tailor things? Maybe! I don’t know or care! I just post things and read things others post. Works fine.

@rauschma I am a software developer but don't run my own instance yet. No concrete plans, maybe in the future. For now just a regular user.

@rauschma I first left Twitter Nov. 2022. Facebook & Insta didn’t appeal to me as a way to exchange ideas, interests & news. Mastodon is where I landed & at first I found it daunting. The first instance I had was European & the traffic on it seemed to drop significantly around 6pm, at least for me who didn’t yet follow tons of people. I soon got the hang of hashtags, though I did have to mute lots of tech, moss & mushroom posts that I wasn’t interested in hearing anything about 😂

@rauschma Normie user here. Rabidly against being fed by an algorithm. Introduced 4 fellow normies to Mastodon a year ago. None of them are still active. Problems I saw: picking an instance is a huge hurdle, too hard to find the people they want to follow, too few of the people they want to interact with are here, and low engagement with their early posts.

@rauschma i have enough knowledge, but I just want it simple to use.

That's why I'm here.😂
(So I leave the tech stuff for the techies and 'complain' when things are not easy. 😉)

#mastodon

@rauschma #4 User who can read Mastodon-API

@rauschma I would say: yes and no.
If you use Mastodon on the computer, it's not more complicated than Twitter or BlueSky.
If you use it on the phone, in the mobile version... well, some improvements would be necessary 😉

@rauschma I don’t think that being tech savvy makes much difference. I was very tech savvy before I retired but when I started on Mastodon in 2017 I had no idea how it worked socially so I eventually got bored and wandered off for a couple of years. OTOH I know several people who are not tech savvy who hung around for all that time.

When people describe what they see as the problems with onboarding most of them seem social even though people keep suggesting tech solutions.

@rauschma@fosstodon.org I probably sits around the second and third option because I'm not really that excel and confidence to code myself, but I'm obviously doing something that normal people around me can't do

@rauschma html and css aren't programming, but i get your point.

@rauschma@fosstodon.org Depends on how you definde "normal" and when I'm not at that category. Beside have some interest in FOSS project (which most people outside that space isn't crazy about), I say I'm normal as I don't code.

@rauschma user configurable algorithms for your mastodon feed are awesome: https://mementomori.social/@rolle/113554010615976066

@rauschma I use IT “often” because it’s my job, but I’m not a developer. 🙄 I’m just developing anger issues when admins and security people are ignored.

@rauschma
Joined December 2022...boomer aged... no problems... no intimidation with using Tusky or Mastodon online.

@rauschma The hurtle for many is "what instance?" The general population doesn't understand fediverse and mastodon and instances. They just want to log onto a service and not have to think about how it works. That's the advantage of Bluesky, etc.

The second thing is that apparently some folk need algorithms because they can't figure out or be bothered to figure out how to find people to follow.

@rauschma normaler Benutzer ohne IT Kenntnisse. und zwar komplett ohne! ich finde mich nichtmal in Internetforen zurecht… 🙈

@rauschma I do not program (anymore) but I am a network admin.

Thus, I know tech and often tries to avoid it (at least what is sold as "tech" to laypeople

@rauschma My iPad wouldn't let me connect to my instance with https://elk.zone, my regular #Mastodon client. I can relate. It's complicated. Folks just need to use #elk. It's so much easier and works for 90% of what you need. It's still in early beta but it's great.

@rauschma I've been in and out of tech jobs for almost 40 years, have been running Linux since 1997, and consider myself an idiot.

@rauschma
Well, you can call me a lot of things, but not "normal" however
from day one i felt surrounded here by a sort of IT people, mostly men, talking in a strange language. Together or in themselves.

I'd just as well have sent myself to Mars.

(But it beats the language of most nasty right wing X-men. One of those just moved to Bluesky. After he downplayed it and Mastodon for that matter.
I hope he and his likes will leave this planet alone;-)

@rauschma Somewhere between 1 and 2.
I enjoy easy challenges and figuring stuff out as I go, but I'm not a programmer or so

Well for the time being
I'm sure I'll have to learn it at some point 😂

@rauschma I like that #3 specifically doesn’t include “loves tech”, sums up most programmers / IT professionals I know quite well

@rauschma where "runs my own server"?

@rauschma I dumped all corporate anti-social media ages ago Mastodon's the only thing I use regularly. I have a Windows 10 machine.

I got the hang of this place relatively quickly. It can be counter-intuitive sometimes but the learning curve is FAR LESS than the average mobile phone.

I'd like to use Linux, but I am trepidatious. Windows 11 is a no-no though.

Some Linux people are COMPLETE PRICKS (who say the worst things to non-Linux users) whilst others try to be helpful and encouraging.

@rauschma I found Mastodon easy to use because I knew going in that it wasn’t Twitter 2.0. Changes mean making adjustments.

@rauschma

HTML? Programming?!

@rauschma I'm a 1 maybe 1+. I find the argument that it's too complicated only slightly more believable than "I voted because of the economy".

There are ways to streamline onboarding, I'm sure.

To me the biggest concern or even only concern with Mastodon and the Fediverse is the bigotry and personal attacks on non white cishet people.

If you are looking for non-tech content on #Mastodon:
* The sustainability crowd is really strong—you can check out who I’m following here: https://mastodon.green/@light_bulbs
* I also have an account about language learning (but there are not as many accounts focussing on that topic—AFAICT): https://mastodon.social/@langtales

@rauschma @simon Even the total non-computerists among us are smarter than the average bear; LOL! My boyfriend is well-educated in the humanities, and he's doing well here.

@rauschma I'm somehow somewhere between all three...

@rauschma
#4 user who hates tech and has to use it often

@rauschma @carbontwelve C++, Assembler, Operating systems.

@rauschma I used to be a user who loves tech and uses it often but now I'm past that stage. I've evolved into a user who hates needlessly complex and badly designed tech but still has to use it often.

@rauschma 🤣

@rauschma

I am glad there's a bigger distance from the Normal user and me on Mastodon

@rauschma #4 User who programs (but never HTML, CSS, JavaScript, etc.)

@rauschma I've done bits of coding in the past - but I'm not a technical person really. I like to explore and figure out all the features available in the tools I use. At work I was considered an Excel guru, but really I was just willing to poke around, do research and figure out how to make it do what needed doing. I'm more someone who knows what's deep in the menus and options, than someone who can code my own software.

@rauschma I voted #2 as that's the way I am now, but I was #3 for over 30 years. I'd like to think I can connect with "normal users" pretty well, though....

@rauschma I had to run through the process of creating an account 3 times due to being banned randomly, without warning and without getting an answer on my appeal on 2 different highly recommended instances - before making a single post or writing anything. My best guess is that my username was mistaken as a bot account, but not responding to appeals is frustrating.

So while it wasn't complicated, I have lost some faith in decentralized instances run on goodwill.

@rauschma

I smiled that the first choice starts at "normal." I'm sub-par tech user. I call people on the actual phone, and my nephew helps me with my laptop, that lil' shit (no seriously, I love him).

I like mastodon because the rules make sense to me. By which I mean the techical rules, how things appear in one's timeline, makes sense.

@rauschma
I consider myself less tech-savvy than an average user actually. Don't even have a smartphone. But I was never a heavy social media user before coming here, so I literally don't know what I'm missing.

@rauschma How do I see the full text of all the options? They are cut off.

@rauschma just want to clarify that just because i am #3 does not mean i am #2

@rauschma h'mmm...

"Federated vs. centralized: Defining this difference for social networks is tricky because there are always some centralized aspects"

What do you consider to be the "centralised" aspects of #Fediverse/#ActivityStreams?

@rauschma HTML, CSS, JavaScript? Shameless Plug: ARM64 Assembly FTW! https://github.com/below/HelloSilicon

@rauschma
Can I say ‘user who can program but detests it with a passion’?

@rauschma #4 User who distrusts tech and uses it often.

@rauschma

Sorry. I couldn't figure out how to vote.

:-)

@rauschma As a normal user, I'd say Mastodon is great as is – and wayyy easier than platforms where getting a feed with no algorithms is difficult if not impossible. I don't want any algorithm. I follow who I follow, mute and block what I want, and explore hashtags when the mood strikes me. Quote posting and seeing all replies seem nice, but tbh, I get along fine without them. I find many tech "improvements" complicate things to the point I give up and walk away.

@rauschma I chose #3 even though I don't really write much code. I am an IT engineer however.

@rauschma I code clients for mastadon so I assume I am tad above "normal", but anyway.

A person using facebook has no rights to say "mastodon is too complicated".

If mastadon is complicated then wtheck is facebook.

I mean, I am a senior software developer, and I left facebook, one of the reasons being I could not even find replies to comments I had left.

People mistake "different" for "complicated".

@rauschma I’ve been here two years and barely have a grasp of how it works. Its ux is absolutely hostile. I assume it’s intentional

@rauschma To make a comparison: X/Bluesky = Windows/macOS, Mastodon = Linux. The technical aspect is just one part, the onboarding is another.

I'm fairly certain that X & Bluesky invest money in focus groups or other types of user investigation to find out what people find difficult. I'm also fairly certain that Mastodon does not.

So with Mastodon you get a platform designed for techies by techies. The starter pack that is all the way at the bottom of your list should be on top.

@rauschma #4 I can read Matrix code

@rauschma
> I often read that Mastodon is too complicated for “normal” people.

It's worth questioning that statement a little, to find out *what* the specific person finds to be too complicated.

When I've done so, it doesn't seem to be about the sign-up process (easy enough) or the user interface.

No, what they seem to describe is: Twitter and Instagram and Facebook just immediately start shoving posts in my face, whatever choices I make. But Mastodon doesn't do that, and that confuses me.

@rauschma What on earth does someone "normal" need to know that is technical to be a user (not a server admin *a user*) of a Mastodon server? **Well not much **but most people use either the default web client or some other which are universally, frankly, dogshit user experiences. I use Elk myself which is by far the best but that is not saying much and it lacks some features. But at least they know enough not to do this passive aggressive BS:

@rauschma I voted #3 because I can or have done things like writing a program, administering a website, using the command line, installing Linux, etc. However, I don't do any of those things on a regular basis, nor do I do them for fun. They're all just means to an end and if I can figure out a way to that end without using digital means, I will choose that in preference because ffs I spend all day on the computer as it is!

@rauschma I don't know what a normal user is (normal on Mastodon?). I love computers and using the internet - I guess this is tech. Most people I know use it everyday. Perhaps they don't love it. Maybe I'm #2 then. I know some HTML and CSS but consider this "household use" like being able to cook at home doesn't make me a chef.

@rauschma I had no idea that I was part of yet another minority. No wonder so few of my friends stayed in 2022. Great survey, very interesting!

@rauschma (2): I bind books, set type, do woodcut + copperplate, make ink + paper, and sew—all analogue communications technologies that had by the 1790s developed global reach in concert with transport infrastructure. (Studying this stuff is what I do professionally.) I see fedi’s do-it-yourself-in-community ethos as continuous with the above and also with early freenets from the Whole Earth Lectronic Link on. There’s a maker-user aspect in public spheres that act as commons.

@rauschma I'm all of those

@rauschma I mean I do software development but honestly signing up to the "default" instance is not exactly that hard 👀

@rauschma
Well that was a tough one. I may be a normal user but I admire tech so I voted for number 2...
Bill

@rauschma

There's a bit in the Canterbury Tales, describing the Clerk

"And gladly would he learn and gladly teach."

I've taught many, many people to write software. I also made them promise to help others, as they had been helped, for this is not a craft for Solo Artistes.

The Masto mindset is similar: nothing is so complex and fearsome that it cannot be explained. We, like the clerk, will gladly teach. In turn, you will teach others.

@rauschma

Fosstodon org... How cool ! If I remember right, I tried to make account there but registration was closed.

I think the biggest Mastodon's problems are completely different. Not technical.

@rauschma no one uses this app boo trash

@rauschma Complexity aside, I was just reading a short post that said a lack of filtering - up front, when accounts are created, not just user-implemented after the fact - would help POC/disabled ppl avoid the microtrauma of dealing with racism, etc., and make Mastodon more friendly.

@rauschma this poll feels like #3 should be the neutral option and it's missing a #4 "rust/nixos/foss maintainer" and #5 "I once wrote an OS or created a new programming language"

@rauschma Mastodon is hard for non-techies. If my spouse wasn't one, I never would have started an account. I can't get any of my friends to come here. The only one who tried it abandoned her account within a week.

@rauschma
I consider myself as normal user. I don't have kind of education in anything related to technology. I'm self-taught at everything related to internet, cell phones, fediversee etc

@rauschma

I checked "#3 User who programs (HTML, CSS, JavaScript, etc.)"

BUT using "HTML, CSS, JavaScript, etc." is
*not* programming.

@rauschma
I called myself #2, but I cross over into #3. 22 years in IT, networks and support Diploma, but no more coding than HTML, was great at translating nerd to n00b, but that was years ago, and...🤔 I probably should have said #3 🤷

@stufromoz

@rauschma I choose 4. I am a professional network designer and administrator. I also administer dozens of Linux systems and write scripts mostly in Bash and Perl.

@rauschma \#4 Person that "hates computers" and can explain to you why in EXTREAM detail. Still owns more computers than the majority of people.

@rauschma I don't think it's too complicated. TBH I don't see why anyone would think it's too complicated.

@rauschma
Top platform around!
Hands down and filled with top notch people.

@rauschma

Replace "normal" with "lazy" and it explains 80% of IT support calls.

@rauschma
user that complains that "writing HTML" is not programming ☝️

@rauschma normal user here. No programming skills. I'm in a completely different profession. I have no problem navigating this platform and don't really understand where the 'difficulty' comes from.

@rauschma i need like a 2.5* which would be: mostly someone tech savvy enough to be dangerous, does a small bit of coding for personal projects.

* but who also kinda hates tech.