Gregory's Servercoming into my mentions going "but training machine learning algorithms is hard too weehhhh!" is grounds for a block. do not fucking do it
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26 comments
@eniko it may be hard, but its not a creative process. thats the important difference  @eniko As a roguelike game developer and player, I have mixed feelings about this. Yes, procedural generation is an incredibly deep topic, and you can use it in your game with intention and skill to make it do what you want. But that's not what happens most of the time. Seeing all the lazy games with random elements in them labeled as "roguelike" gets tiring very fast. At this point Poker qualifies as roguelike.  @deshipu @eniko Well that's more of a game design issue, yeah you can make an amazing procedural generation algorithm and create complex and beautiful worlds, but if the player has nothing to do in it, then it's a bad game.  @eniko omg they have "AI reply guy" in their bio. Points for self-awareness, I guess.  this post has rapidly breached containment so im muting this thread for my sanity  @eniko The Deep Rock Galactic people recently posted an explanation of their cave generation which goes reasonably deep and shows pretty nicely how much human input is needed there. In short: They do hand-made rooms and modify them, and take into account the mission type, biome and a bunch of other stuff. (edit: link directly to post) @eniko I can not stress enough how AI as a term has completely disrupted the industry entirely. What used to be how we defined npc and enemy behavior in a game is now used in a completely different way. Now anything generated by a computer is considered "AI", even though, as you said, it's something very specifically crafted. We defined it's rules and behaviors. We made the equations. @eniko reminded of kkrieger which IIRC is procedurally generated for being one of those tiny filesize FPS games? I'd always heard it as such when I first learned about it 20 years ago  @eniko that technique was used in Moria circa 1978 on the PLATO educational computer system, too. So yeah, not โAIโ.  @eniko Noita uses it to with many many fun outputs https://noitagame.com/ @eniko itโs all human crafted game content; it just uses a stochastic compression algorithm   @eniko I think the most effective game to mention is Minecraft, because of the near-universal familiarity. They were building procedural-generation algorithms in 2012 and everything about world generation is procedural. In Java! Itโs a disgrace to conflate this with GenAI.  |
@eniko harder than procgen and gives worse results? ๐ค
I think we have a name for that... the walkway curb effect