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Remença

@sjuvonen @tinker

Finally, if we theorize on what would happening AI would reach parity with humans, we could just put AI to do all the work while we could spend our days doing whatever we enjoy, be it drawing or being at the bar.

18 comments
Sami Juvonen replied to Remença

@remenca @tinker You would be OK with enslaving human level intelligences?

Remença replied to Sami

@sjuvonen @tinker

I would be ok with a AI that makes the work I do not want to do.

Sami Juvonen replied to Remença

@remenca @tinker You better be careful what you wish for. You wish to be made redundant by an AI.

When you dig down, there appear to be two kinds of AI boosters (who are not shareholders in a hot company).

One group wants slaves.

One group wants to build a god and become its priesthood.

The common thread is that both enforce and encode a strict hierarchy in society.

Remença replied to Sami

@sjuvonen @tinker I guess that a third one uses false dichotomies to win discussions, because I see another option which is: the AI are socialized and the profits produced are distributed among the people.

Шуро replied to Sami

@tinker @remenca @sjuvonen I think it is wrong to think in such form.

First AI is nowhere near approaching let alone enslaving human intelligence. Right now AI is not even intelligence and it is unclear if it will make that leap to become one. Maybe it will forever stay just advanced text autocomplete and information guesser.

Second - it is just a tool. Bad or good but a tool. Sure in some aspects it surpasses certain human abilities. Just like a car is faster than human natural movement and it allows carrying much greater weight over much longer distances. But it supplements our abilities not enslaves us.

Talking of AI as potentially omnipotent evil is just adding to the hype.

@tinker @remenca @sjuvonen I think it is wrong to think in such form.

First AI is nowhere near approaching let alone enslaving human intelligence. Right now AI is not even intelligence and it is unclear if it will make that leap to become one. Maybe it will forever stay just advanced text autocomplete and information guesser.

http :verified: replied to Remença

@remenca @sjuvonen @tinker That is exactly what will not happen. The exact same ("being able to relax and let the machines do the work") was predicted when steam engines and later electricity came up. And look at us now. Even more work and those things you can use the machines for are expected from you anyway, even if you don't need to spend many hours of your day washing clothes by hand or plowing a field with an ox. But yes, also AI will increase our overall productivity to a new level that will be expected from everyone. And you will still have no time to relax, but hopefully a slightly better life.

@remenca @sjuvonen @tinker That is exactly what will not happen. The exact same ("being able to relax and let the machines do the work") was predicted when steam engines and later electricity came up. And look at us now. Even more work and those things you can use the machines for are expected from you anyway, even if you don't need to spend many hours of your day washing clothes by hand or plowing a field with an ox. But yes, also AI will increase our overall productivity to a new level that will...

Remença replied to http

@http @sjuvonen @tinker

I totally agree. Actually, this was my point all the time. But with single catch. You failed to mention why this will and has happened. And the reason is because those technological improvements have been always in hands of the rich. It is not a problem of technology itself, it is a problem of who owns it. It is a political problem. Therefore, it makes no sense to blame AI for it. It is like blaming laundry machines for the loss of jobs of the launderers.

http :verified: replied to Remença

@remenca @sjuvonen @tinker I fail to see the political thing in it. We all have electricity and laundry machines now and profit from cheap food, not just "the rich". And we cannot relax and let the machines do most of our work; it's just that our work has changed to most of us being no longer farmers. Same I expect for AI. I have no idea where AI will be most successful, but if it can produce "better art" or "more secure coders" (both not the case now, by far) or whatever, then these jobs will be replaced and we will do even harder work on things AI cannot do.

@remenca @sjuvonen @tinker I fail to see the political thing in it. We all have electricity and laundry machines now and profit from cheap food, not just "the rich". And we cannot relax and let the machines do most of our work; it's just that our work has changed to most of us being no longer farmers. Same I expect for AI. I have no idea where AI will be most successful, but if it can produce "better art" or "more secure coders" (both not the case now, by far) or whatever, then these jobs will be...

Remença replied to http

@http @sjuvonen @tinker

I'm tempted to reply but think it will be better if you reach the conclusion by yourself, so I will only ask: You say that if AI takes over our jobs we will end doing the more menial tasks that AI cannot do. But those task must have been being done now anyway, no? So what will change?

http :verified: replied to Remença

@remenca @sjuvonen @tinker New kind of jobs and especially services came out of electrification. I don't expect that AI will take only the mental part and we end up with currently existing jobs of being hairdressers and waiters, but instead new services will emerge. 200 years ago, nobody could imagine a world with most jobs being not a farmer or craftsman.

Remença replied to http

@http @sjuvonen @tinker

I'm not a native speaker and sometimes I'm unable to convey what I meant. My question was more to point that those menial jobs, like farmer or waiter, that cannot be automatized with AI (at least in its present incarnation) are already being fulfilled by humans, so it does not matter how much AI we add to society, those jobs will still to be done all the same. Nothing will change in that regard.

Remença replied to http

@http @sjuvonen @tinker

Also, your statement of "we al have electricity and we all profit from cheap food" is not true in almost the entire planet and in around 30% of USA I think, but let's leave that aside for the moment being.

http :verified: replied to Remença

@remenca @sjuvonen @tinker If you look at the industrialization, this helped everyone worldwide and extreme poverty levels have sunken to historic lows. So yes, this indeed helped everyone.

Remença replied to http

@http @sjuvonen @tinker

No, this is not true. When industrialization is paired with capitalism it results in that the capitalist take over everything and the rest get poorer.

sciencedirect.com/science/arti

http :verified: replied to Remença

@remenca @sjuvonen @tinker The charts on en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extreme_ shows what I meant. Your article (colonialism, capitalism) might be true, but is a different topic. Yes, when everyone is a farmer and can care for theirselves, there is almost no extreme poverty. Too off-topic to discuss further though.

Remença replied to http

@http @sjuvonen @tinker

I fail to convey my point. What I say is that what problem there is with artists and other intellectual workers losing their jobs and joining the ranks of the manual workers? Is manual work lesser than intellectual work?

Iron Bug replied to Remença
@tinker @sjuvonen @remenca this will never happen. never. because human brain works totally different than computational algorithms. and we still have too little knowledge about how brain works.
that that they call "AI" now is nothing like "intelligence". it's just statistical maths with databases, nothing more. no magic, no intellect. stupid algorithms. poor and useless results that cannot be used in business or whatever because this is not intelligence. this is just stochastic subsets of junk datasets. and some people believe this is "intelligence". it's not. nothing reliable, nothing recurrent, nothing reproducible, this is not knowledge, it's just random junk.
and the bubble will burst, at last. major investors have already got this and stopped financing that hoax.
@tinker @sjuvonen @remenca this will never happen. never. because human brain works totally different than computational algorithms. and we still have too little knowledge about how brain works.
that that they call "AI" now is nothing like "intelligence". it's just statistical maths with databases, nothing more. no magic, no intellect. stupid algorithms. poor and useless results that cannot be used in business or whatever because this is not intelligence....
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