Email or username:

Password:

Forgot your password?
Graham Spookyland🎃/Polynomial

thread in which I talk about why the "wrap your games console in a towel" or "reflow the bga" thing works to fix some consoles, and it's nothing to do with solder balls.

chaos.social/@gsuberland/11308

14 comments
Graham Spookyland🎃/Polynomial

after that supreme nerdsnipage I am going to sleep

scy

@gsuberland nerdsnipage is an anagram of penis dragen

Marc Jacobs

@gsuberland AFAIK there was a materials problem with solder joint reliability that caused Red Ring of Death. Or, if it was a capacitor problem, the caps were on the BGA itself and not on the motherboard.

This is based what people were oddly quiet about, and who was quiet.

9names

@trollball @gsuberland youtu.be/z2d6IMBS8oY?t=1148
this is publicly confirmed as the root cause for the high rate of RROD in early xbox360's

Marc Jacobs

@9names @gsuberland They skim over that it was a temp cycle failure between the die and the BGA substrate, on a FCBGA. Not between the BGA substrate and the PCB.

The video makes it sound like temp cycling is an odd thing to cause failures.

Marc Jacobs

@gsuberland Which is not to say your bit about ceramic capacitors is incorrect. I am a chip guy not a ceramic person.

Stu

@gsuberland that's amazing, cheers. Believed to this day it was about solder. So were Microsoft penny pinching on the 360's design?

I never did try the towel technique. My launch model died after 13 months, its replacement was DOA, and I sold my third one to move. My 4th (the redesigned jasper model) eventually died, but reapplying thermal paste and using a new X frame to hold the heatsink in place sorted it out. Although I only tried after buying a 360E. So have two! They both still work.

Ben Etherington

@gsuberland this has got to be a fork of Hanlon’s razor. Maybe: Don’t attribute to the frustration of BGAs that which can be attributed to penny-pinching?

vxo

@gsuberland wow! just when I thought I could trust MLCC's

gudenau

@gsuberland This is some really cool information, thanks for sharing!

Go Up