Email or username:

Password:

Forgot your password?
Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

Huh. Google Maps on Android is no longer plotting walking paths when returning public transit directions.

It's doing the following instead.

(To generate this example, I requested public transit directions from Park Street Station to the Harvard Science Center.)

98 comments
Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

In that example, the walking path is trivial – just follow Kirkland.

There are, of course, routes that are not trivial.

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

And you'll notice, even on that example, the resolution is not fine enough that the cross streets are named. The only thing that makes these directions followable is that Kirkland ends at the Science Center; if Kirkland continued, the cross street you are to turn on to get to the Science Center is not named on the map.

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

The other interesting change that just happened is now searching for public transit directions automatically includes solutions that involve ride hailing services. Apparently if the walk between a bus stop and a destination is sufficiently far – I don't know what the distance threshold is – instead of showing you that walk and including its duration in the time estimate, it just includes a ride hailing call, and the estimate of the duration of that ride hailing trip.

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

This is an option one can turn off, but I don't know if it's possible to turn it off as a default, instead of as a trip by trip option.

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

These changes are, in case it wasn't obvious, extremely not good.

I'm guessing that whoever authorized these changes has never actually used public transit? Or perhaps never relied on it.

This may come as a huge shock to the people at Google, but a very large percentage of those who use public transit do so not because it is convenient or nice, because it is often neither, but because they are poor. And they can't just be whipping out their wallets to hire an Uber or a Lyft.

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

Furthermore, because this is America, an unfortunate lot of people stuck being poor wound up that way because they are disabled, and it matters a lot to them how long it takes to walk from a bus stop to a destination. Heretofore, Google Maps was a tool that allowed such people to find out what the walk would be between a public transit stop and their ultimate destination.

Aurora 🏳️‍🌈 (Snowy Version ❄️)

@siderea Google maps has always been terrible for walking, which is a huge shame. Not surprised they decided to just give up. For anyone willing to download a new app I would recommend Transit and Cyclers depending on your needs. Both of them do an infinitely better job than Google maps.

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

Here is perhaps a more telling example.

I asked Google Maps to give me the directions by public transit from Park Street Station to the Harvard Museum of Natural History.

Locals will realize how incredibly bad this is:

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

This is not merely inconvenient. This one's dangerous.

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

@whitequark I don't know if you're local or not. I've just spent the last 15 minutes trying to figure out how to explain or illustrate through Google Street view what the terrain is that that... lack of a set of directions... turn someone loose on.

There is an abundance of perfectly safe pedestrian routes for that path. Also, there's something a lot like a highway on-ramp in the middle of it. That is not indicated on that map.

✧✦✶✷Catherine✷✶✦✧ replied to Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

@siderea nope, only been in the US briefly, so it's not obvious to me

Aeronaute replied to ✧✦✶✷Catherine✷✶✦✧

@whitequark @siderea This view shows what I think is the worst street crossing from those directions. You'd be crossing in the foreground here, from right to left. Once you've jumped over the fence and down into the roadway at the blind curve, made it past the cars emerging from a dark tunnel, you hit a retaining wall that keeps you from getting out of the roadway. If you try to bypass that, the road has a blind curve so the traffic has less chance to see you.

google.com/maps/@42.3761072,-7

@whitequark @siderea This view shows what I think is the worst street crossing from those directions. You'd be crossing in the foreground here, from right to left. Once you've jumped over the fence and down into the roadway at the blind curve, made it past the cars emerging from a dark tunnel, you hit a retaining wall that keeps you from getting out of the roadway. If you try to bypass that, the road has a blind curve so the traffic has less chance to see you.

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis replied to Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

@whitequark There is no line of sight to the safe walking paths from the subway head house those directions have a pedestrian emerging from.

As a consequence, tourists emerging from that head house en route to, e.g. the Harvard Museum of Natural History, sometimes think to get to their destination they have to somehow get across that thing that is like a highway on ramp... the hard way.

Brian Campbell replied to ✧✦✶✷Catherine✷✶✦✧

@whitequark @siderea Here's a Google Street View image of about where the dotted line in that screenshot crosses the street.

And it's even worse because right here the road is coming out from a tunnel under a pedestrian plaza where you can cross with ease; but that is not at all apparent on the map, it just looks like road the whole way.

Rivetgeek replied to Brian

@unlambda @whitequark @siderea I'd note the curved dotted line is *not* supposed to be your projected path. It's a :shrug: response that indicates you're on your own. No, it's not great in any measure. At least since we moved to WA three years ago, Google Maps has done that consistently for walking directions. It's been a PITA when we go into downtown Seattle and are going to park and walk because I have to fiddle with the options to get a walking path.

Brian Campbell replied to Rivetgeek

@rivetgeek @whitequark @siderea But the confusing thing about it is that it's not just a single "shrug" dotted line; it's not a single segment, there's some kind of waypoint in between.

And it's a regression; Google Maps is capable of generating plausible walking directions for this route, and I believe that it used to do so for transit directions (though it's been a while since I've used transit directions, moved out of the city several years back), but it now seems to just give the "shrug."

Brian Campbell replied to Brian

@whitequark @siderea It's even more puzzling because Google Maps is perfectly capable of generating reasonable-ish walking directions for the same start point and destination if you ask for walking directions. I just have no idea what's going on with the dotted line in the transit directions; it's not even just a single "dotted line to your destination", it seems to have a waypoint that explicitly leads you astray.

Brian Campbell replied to Brian

@whitequark @siderea I'll also note that the first time I tried to take this screenshot, Google Maps caused Firefox to bog down, and then crash.

Now, who knows if that's a Firefox bug, or a graphics driver issue, but it's kind of funny when it happened, and it looks like the new Google Maps rendering may be a lot more demanding.

Brian Campbell replied to Brian

@whitequark @siderea Oh, and for some more context, if you did try to roughly follow the dotted line, of course you wouldn't try to cross at the point pictured. You would naturally follow the path in the little island park up to the intersection, where there is technically a crossing. But this is the crossing; one of the most confusing intersections I have ever encountered.

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis replied to Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

@whitequark All you have to do to get to the Harvard Museum of Natural History from that exit from the subway, is just stay on the sidewalk, and follow its curve around Harvard Yard. Easy peasy.

That takes you to a pleasant courtyard that doesn't exist on that map, and which sits on top of the thing that is like a highway on ramp. There is no evidence that this thing exists on that map.

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis replied to Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

@whitequark this all has the additional exacerbation that it's Harvard Goddamn University. I really can't overstate the extent of lost tourists, lost new students, lost parents, lost visiting scholars, wandering around this part of the world lost, on foot, and straying into traffic.

it's B! Cavello 🐝

@siderea this sucks. Thanks for sharing.
It doesn’t solve the Google Maps issue, but I have found the Transit App to be a pretty robust option that seems to have a less sketchy business model
transitapp.com/

Nire Bryce

@siderea
maps does this for me when my Wi-Fi signal is terrible but isn't terrible enough to switch over to data, so I wonder if it's stuck in offline mode

(but it could also just be we're on different a/b test branches )

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

@NireBryce Oooh! I hadn't thought of that possibility. I do seem to be having some local network problems intermittently. Perhaps this will go away.

Vinay ಕಶ್ಯಪ್ (Mr./Dr.)

@siderea This is par for the course. Google maps has been giving me wrong directions in the Boston area for more than a decade.

Rachael Ludwick

@siderea One from Seattle I got the other day. It used to show a dotted walking route that went along the crosswalk locations (the stripes of gray) but now just shows a straight diagonal. Across one of the most dangerous streets in town. I don’t think anyone would actually follow this route but it’s baffling to present it this way as it elides the need for two crossings of streets.

Rachael Ludwick

@siderea To the low signal reply that just loaded for me this was DEFINITELY not low signal as this screenshot was done on my home gigabit internet service which is a couple miles north of the location in this image.

Megan Fox

@siderea huh, it's like if Bethesda gave walking direction

"and now simply use your scroll of Icarian Flight and gracefully leap to the destination"

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

@glassbottommeg
It is clearly marked: two steps with one's seven league boots.

Chris Adams

@joeyh @siderea that’s identical to Apple Maps, which makes me think everything using OSM will avoid the tunnel.

George Girton

@siderea that is a wacky route for sure, but at least you get to see the statue of Charles Sumner in MacArthur Square

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statue_o

Sarma / Amras

@siderea I remember years back abandoning Google Maps for transit when I left the US, because the data it was working off was extremely limited.

A big task for local public transit apps is to know which APIs to pull from for a given region - what municipal & private organizations actually operate here and where they publish their data.

At the time, Google Maps seemed to mainly be aware of the US-based firms (Uber etc), plus a small handful of bus lines they manually imported.

Sarma / Amras

@siderea That definitely gave the illusion that hiring an uber was the best option - otherwise you'd be stuck waiting an hour for the bus.

To combat that, our transit stops have a printed list of apps which actually use the city's API. Google Maps isn't listed.

JP

@siderea yeah it's very obviously an ideology-made-policy, hypernormalization style, of some fucking techies who would rather call an uber than walk a few blocks. they're everywhere in SF and they contribute to the car dependence paradigm here that creates traffic where none would otherwise be, blocks bike lanes, and ultimately kills more pedestrians and cyclists yearly.

mcc

@siderea the ride sharing mode, in my testing, if I disable it once, it stays disabled even on force quitting and resetting the app.

Of course, since the new "and then you fly through the air" UI makes Google Maps useless, it doesn't really matter D:

Vaguely here 🏳️‍⚧️🏳️‍🌈

@siderea if I ask for public transit directions in my city sometimes it suggests I first drive to a transit stop.

cpm

@siderea
heh:

"ride hailing services"

what a terrible joke.

just fwiw

got no beef with those folks burying themselves in automobile-debt-losses,me.

they are working, just like the rest of us.

but it's a big grift that keeps on grifting

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

@cpm Yeah, there's that.

And there's also the fact that you have no idea how long it's going to take a ride hailing service to get to you. So, so much for using Google Maps for estimating how long to leave to get somewhere on time by public transit.

Takemusu

@siderea I think Google wants you to fly or at least vault to your desired location. Perhaps a trebuchet can be used?

『-𝚍𝚜𝚛-』

@RoverStoker @siderea

The trebuchet is strictly for partial traversal of the Charles River. There are many fine bridges with pedestrian access for that route.

Alex

@siderea
I suspect that walkers frequently diverted from their guidance, as shortcuts across parking lots and lawns are possible to make for a person but not for a corporate product to recommend.

The "get there how you can" approach might show the correspondingly faster speed now that those more circuitous legal routes aren't constraining the path.

Siderea, Sibylla Bostoniensis

@MisterMadge This was an excellent opportunity for you not to share your uninformed opinion.

Martijn Faassen

@siderea
see it in the Netherlands too. That's a pretty strange change, especially when it can still plan walking routes separately. I wonder what motivates it.

Mary Lacroix

@siderea Google Maps is doing the same thing on my iPhone. Until very recently, it would precisely lay out the walking route required to get to transit, but I get the same bullshit arc now. Citymapper used to offer the trebuchet option, but Google has made it the default.

Pratik Patel

@siderea Lol. I wonder if they tried to AIify this by telling the AI that the shortest route between two points is a straight line.

Marcos Dione

@siderea you're supposed to jump and fly the last 4 mins, at walking speed.

I wish I could tell you 'Seriously, just drop that useless map' (which it is as a map), but unfortunately nobody bets them with PT info.

Nelson Chu Pavlosky

@siderea In case anyone is wondering, it's not just on Android; walking directions appear to have also been abandoned in the web interface.

Andrew Gallagher

@siderea Doing similar for me on iOS. Interestingly, it also does the same fake routing if part of the mixed mode journey is driving, which is utterly baffling.

Bastian Greshake Tzovaras

@siderea it does the same on iOS now. I guess that’s one way to get people to use Apple Maps instead🤦

Sova

@siderea I noticed that today as well and it appears that it does it on desktop as well now.

Aljoscha Rittner (beandev)

@siderea
I checked it for Germany and here it's working (Android 14, Pixel 6pro) with public transportation routing.

anufea

@siderea I noticed this as well when I tried to find out whether there was a pedestrian crossing at a particular spot in a junction the other day. Completely useless.

Go Up