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Björkus "No time_t to Die" Dorkus

I deserve better than this opaque, institutional bickerings from a mature, open-source programming language.

The Pasture | I Am No Longer Speaking at RustConf 2023 | thephd.dev/i-am-no-longer-spea

32 comments
Federico Mena Quintero

@thephd oh no, I was looking forward to this talk :(

Björkus "No time_t to Die" Dorkus

@federicomena Yeah, sorry about that. Hopefully the other talks still deliver!

Genders: ♾️, 🟪⬛🟩; Soni L.

@thephd ugh, that's disappointing.

may you find... better things to work on in the future? we're sorry.

Félix

@thephd sorry to read that. I think you made the right decision.

B3NNY and the JITs

@thephd This is sad to see. I think your written post presented some really good ideas, plus it was well-received. Project leadership is overdue for some self-reflection (pun intended).

Björkus "No time_t to Die" Dorkus

@B3NNY sjdhuddfjfhchs oh not the pun made me laugh with water it's in mYy NOSE.OH GOD aaaaaaa

yosh

@thephd ooffff, I'm really sorry that happened - imo your decision to step away from speaking at RustConf is entirely justified.

James Widman

@thephd even if they wanted to change their policy so that keynotes are only for topics approved by the Rust Project, it seems like the time frame to put that new policy into effect would be after the 2023 conference and before the call-for-papers for the 2024 conference.

brk, a.k.a. @evanrichter

@thephd what a strange interaction lol. Good on you for (respectfully) not putting up with it

Chandler Carruth

@thephd =[ Really sorry about all of this. Found the midterm report super interesting and am still looking forward to learning more.

pyro

@thephd this is *deeply* messed up behavior from the project leadship! what the fuck!

Ivy :fire_trans:

@thephd wtf!??!? what is going on with the rust foundation?!??!! dang I'm sorry they did that crap to you :bear_hugs:

jannic

@thephd I sincerely hope that there were no bad intentions involved and that it was just a serious case of miscommunication.
In any case, you deserve an explanation and probably an apology from the RustConf organizers.
At the same time, keep in mind that organizing an event like RustConf is a difficult and stressful task. Under stress, people make mistakes. Please try to give them some leeway and do not push them into a defensive position.

Björkus "No time_t to Die" Dorkus

@jannic RustConf was following the direction and lead of the Rust Project, here. The Rust Project has (still) unaired grievances with the direction of compile-time programming, and chose to air those grievances VIA a talk demotion rather than any actionable or explained feedback (or even just a "We hate this, stop doing this").

That's the core problem. Not RustConf having a hard time; everyone behaved exactly as they wanted to, at no point was the sequence of decisions that led to use here rushed or in-error, or so I've been informed repeatedly.

@jannic RustConf was following the direction and lead of the Rust Project, here. The Rust Project has (still) unaired grievances with the direction of compile-time programming, and chose to air those grievances VIA a talk demotion rather than any actionable or explained feedback (or even just a "We hate this, stop doing this").

jannic

@thephd Is the "Rust Project" something homogeneous enough to have one opinion about topics like compile-time programming? I don't have internal insights, but I imagine it's a relatively heterogeneous group of people.
Obviously somebody acted in a weird way, intentionally or by mistake. But I have no idea how that could have happened, so I'm not going to point to any particular person or group. I'm sorry if my first message could be interpreted as blaming the RustConf organiziers.

Björkus "No time_t to Die" Dorkus

@jannic Either one person (or multiple people) lied and presented their personal decision as a Rust Project-approved criticism of the talk and the compile-time midterm programming report,

OR

enough of them had misgivings that they could not have the talk or the compile-time midterm programming report, and as a group reached that consensus.

In BOTH cases, they aired that grievance by taking a Rust Project-level decision (through RustConf and not informing me of it themselves) to tell me they don't like the direction. Up until now (literally, as we're talking, as this blog post has gone out!), no Rust Project leadership has explained and/or justified their decision, as either a group or individuals! Using RustConf organizers as a vehicle to initially reveal your disdain for a thing, and not explain that disdain in literally any way after being repeatedly told this is not something we have to do to start with, is extremely sloppy!!

@jannic Either one person (or multiple people) lied and presented their personal decision as a Rust Project-approved criticism of the talk and the compile-time midterm programming report,

OR

enough of them had misgivings that they could not have the talk or the compile-time midterm programming report, and as a group reached that consensus.

kleines Filmröllchen

@thephd @jannic I have seen that as well with other projects. If you come to me with reasoned complaints, we can discuss. If you shut me down with no explanation, then that's much worse.

Am I?

🔃
Wow, This seems like a strange way to act.
I thought Rust ppl were supposed to be the cool one, who got it together and didn't do crappy stuff like this to people.

Alex

@ami
Yeah no, that community seems to be mostly based on fanbois/cultists that always have to flaunt rust in an obnoxious way...
I've only met a tiny fraction of supporters that were level headed (rust is just another tool).

CULTPONY :verified: :v_bi:

@thephd I do love me (not) some drama at FOSS orgs. tired sigh

thomas

@thephd What a bizarre situation. Thanks for all the interesting writing, and I hope you get treated more reasonably in future.

e. hashman

@thephd you absolutely deserve better than this. I'm so sorry to hear about this.

Akseli :quake_verified:

@thephd Am proud of you standing your ground! Good decision, even though it can be dissapointing to many. Of course, sorry to hear what happened.

Guillaume Racicot

@thephd damn. Why do all the good and mature languages seem to just reject reflection these days?

Wil van Antwerpen ✅

@thephd that's horrendous.
So sorry you had to go through this.

kaelef

@thephd it’s bizarre how frequently I hear of organizational/political machinations with the Rust project that cast a shadow on it all. It’s too bad people don’t seem to know how to behave professionally.

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