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Ian Coldwater 📦💥

It has come to my attention that there are younger folks who haven’t heard of Five Geek Social Fallacies.

It was written in 2003 and the social dynamics stay real. Once you read it, you’ll see them everywhere.

plausiblydeniable.com/five-gee

35 comments
Ben

@ian immediate reaction is that GSF1 explains why people in Twitter leadership were so loudly against deplatforming

Yellow Flag

@sangster @ian Or why it is so hard to exclude known rapists or sexual harassers from developer conferences.

Kit Bashir

@ian ooh i think you slashdotted it, it’s completely ianized

gws

@Unixbigot @ian Got it good with the Low Orbit Ian Cannon

Ian Coldwater 📦💥

Apparently I brought back 2003 in more ways than one by slashdotting their server, so here’s an archived version

web.archive.org/web/2024011321

Jake Carpenter

@ian omg I’ve been sitting here working in the wording for the exact same joke

Ian Coldwater 📦💥

@securingdev so 2003! I posted an archived version in thread

nobody

@ian Damn! That's a term I haven't heard in many years

Third spruce tree on the left

@ian holy shit. I was a carrier for all 5 at various points back in the day. Obvious now. This explains so much of my late 20s, early 30s and why my social life was so exhausting.

Regis - HTTP 1.1/418 Teapot

@ian @SarraceniaWilds These and pervocracy’s piece on “missing stairs” were honestly so illuminating for me to understand why my communities were the way they were. pervocracy.blogspot.com/2012/0 (note: much of the rest of the site describes nsfw stuff) [edited because I called it broken stair not missing stair]

William Canna-bass

@rmd1023 @ian @SarraceniaWilds
This does more to explain our society than the 5 Social Falacies for me.

William Canna-bass

@rmd1023 @ian @SarraceniaWilds Specifically referencing the Broken stair article. Looks like there are two different links.

William Canna-bass

@rmd1023 @ian @SarraceniaWilds
Also, this sounds like a profoundly unsafe community, I would hesitate to even call them Kinksters. Consent is number one in our community, and I am frankly surprised that the author's community allowed this person.

Around these parts, you get black listed very quickly for any boundary violations, even online. We had a guy put his hand on a gal's shoulder in our group (w/o consent) to get her attention. Boom, disinvited from all future events, even the Munches. We also had a guy do some boundary violations on FetLife, so he was also banned.

Obviously, neither of these two people tried to correct their mistakes, so Restorative Justice was not possible. That being said, the fact that this person raped another is such an egregious boundary violation that there can be no opportunity for Restorative Justice, only Ostracization if not legal consequences IMO.

@rmd1023 @ian @SarraceniaWilds
Also, this sounds like a profoundly unsafe community, I would hesitate to even call them Kinksters. Consent is number one in our community, and I am frankly surprised that the author's community allowed this person.

Around these parts, you get black listed very quickly for any boundary violations, even online. We had a guy put his hand on a gal's shoulder in our group (w/o consent) to get her attention. Boom, disinvited from all future events, even the Munches. We also...

William Canna-bass

@rmd1023 @ian @SarraceniaWilds
"Oh, but, like, she only said he raped her and no one was there to see it and it was really confusing and stuff and anyway what do you want us to do, like, treat the guy like a leper? "

This is an insult to Lepers, as leprosy can be cured. Absolutely, he should be banished to an island. Rape is a very deliberate act.

pervocracy.blogspot.com/2012/0

William Canna-bass

@rmd1023 @ian @SarraceniaWilds
"When I posted about a rapist in a community I belonged to, although I gave almost no details about the guy except "he's a rapist," I immediately got several emails from other members of that community saying "oh, you must mean X." Everyone knew who he was! Tons of people, including several in the leadership, instantly knew who I meant."

#RedFlag alert - leave this community immediately!

pervocracy.blogspot.com/2012/0

@rmd1023 @ian @SarraceniaWilds
"When I posted about a rapist in a community I belonged to, although I gave almost no details about the guy except "he's a rapist," I immediately got several emails from other members of that community saying "oh, you must mean X." Everyone knew who he was! Tons of people, including several in the leadership, instantly knew who I meant."

William Canna-bass

@rmd1023 @ian @SarraceniaWilds
I would argue that a missing stair is understating the problem. If you have a rapist in your community, this is the better analogy.
youtu.be/LNVFPkmZTQ4?si=Z3QY22

William Canna-bass

@rmd1023 @ian @SarraceniaWilds

I would add to the suggestions that any play parties have designated dungeon monitors and that the Safe words should only be Green/Yellow/Red and that everyone at the party has a responsibility to stop a scene if the top/bottom calls Red.

pervocracy.blogspot.com/2012/0

Richard Cantzler

@ian this matches a non-geek friend 5/5. A few friends suffer from very subtle / borderline versions of one or two of these, but batting 5 outta 5 for one friend is devastating (it's a train wreck to watch).

Aphrodite ☑️ :boost_ok:

@ian

GSF4 is one that took me a long time to come to terms with.

I tend to be the point of a lambda (Λ) in relationships. A and B like me; A and B hate each others’ guts.

Upside for me is a more diverse set of social connections.

Downside is that I’ve ignored, to my peril, when a healthier relationship earned me that another relationship was an unhealthy one.

Quantum Gardener

@ian @bitprophet I’m and older folks who has never heard of it. Shall read with interest.

Little1Lost

@ian i was not even in kindergarden at that time.
interesting and timeless read.
i will save it somewhere and share it from time to time IF i think about it

TiTiNoNero :__:

@ian that was illuminating. However it applies only if one has "friends". Thank god I'm free from these.

James Laverack

@ian when I was shown this list for the first time it completely changed my view on every social circle I was in.

europlus :autisminf:

@ian @alda I’m a geek and I applaud the smashing of these fallacies.

derheap

@ian I need new glasses. I first read Greek Social Fallacies. All dating back to the old greek philosophers.

GreenSkyOverMe (Monika)

@ian I was half-way through when I realized this doesn’t say Greek

Pozorvlak

@ian I think 5GSF caused an overcorrection - "that's a Geek Social Fallacy! Stop doing it!" No, the GSF correctly identifies a way that the mainstream world is too cruel, and we should try to do better (but not at the cost of our own sanity).

Alex Von Kitchen

@ian It's interesting how these were used by Gamergate and other fascists to infiltrate geek groups

Tatzelbrumm

@ian
Looks to me like younger folks in the "Five New States" in Germany are VERY aware that an overzealous attempt to remedy the Geek Social Fallacies ostracizes them on general principle,

and, irrespective of any agreement or disagreement on political issues,
they strike back hard.

spectator.co.uk/article/the-af

Christoph Vigano

@ian
Oooh, haven't read that in a long time. Thanks for reminding me! 😊

Matt Decuir

@ian I had never seen this before and it is fascinating! Thanks for sharing, Ian

Mx Amber Alex

@ian GSF2 is RAMPANT on AO3. The comment culture there (unlike FFN, where comments are called "reviews") is such that any criticism, no matter how polite or constructive, is considered taboo, rude, and offensive unless the author explicitly invites it.

Anything less favourable than "omg i love this story this is the best thing ever omg" is met with (ironically, considering GSF1 is also quite prevalent there for the most part) uninhibited vitriol telling the critic to go fuck themselves and die and stop being so negative and they're probably an "anti" anyway.

And despite this violent form of GSF2, GSF1 dominates the site as well, because any attempt to discuss trolls, rampant racism and misogyny, etc. on the site is also met with accusations of being an "anti", wanting "censorship", and whatnot.

@ian GSF2 is RAMPANT on AO3. The comment culture there (unlike FFN, where comments are called "reviews") is such that any criticism, no matter how polite or constructive, is considered taboo, rude, and offensive unless the author explicitly invites it.

Anything less favourable than "omg i love this story this is the best thing ever omg" is met with (ironically, considering GSF1 is also quite prevalent there for the most part) uninhibited vitriol telling the critic to go fuck themselves and die and...

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