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Angelino Desmet.

“Stable release users should read the release notes.”

No they shouldn't. That's exactly why they use stable: so things don't break unexpectedly and they can work on problems that they want/need to work on.

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@juliank @tuxwise @keepassxc

11 May at 5:59 | Wall-to-wall | Open on fosstodon.org
8 comments
Julian Andres Klode 🏳️‍🌈

@stardust @tuxwise @keepassxc That's a misunderstanding, they should read the release notes when upgrading to the next release

11 May at 6:34 | Open on mastodon.social
Team KeePassXC

@juliank @stardust @tuxwise@tchncs.de I disagree with this statement on a fundamental level. If you see Debian as an expert tool for a very specific expert target group, then fine, whatever. But Debian is the base for a general-purpose operating system for millions of users with no technical background or simply no nerve and time to deal with things like this. You cannot and should not expect these users to know about any obscure text files, let alone read and understand the tech babble that's in them.

11 May at 9:36 | Open on fosstodon.org
Team KeePassXC

@juliank @stardust @tuxwise@tchncs.de I certainly don't fire up a text editor and check the NOTES files first before I run apt upgrade or click the "Install now" button on the update reminder popup and I am probably much more of an expert user. We can only implore you to revert your decision. Your concerns about supply chain attacks in particular are certainly not unfounded, but you cannot export the complexity of this decision to your users in a way they will not and cannot understand.

11 May at 9:36 | Open on fosstodon.org
Julian Andres Klode 🏳️‍🌈

@keepassxc I think renaming the package to keepassxc-minimal will make it much clearer, and I'll try to do that and I hope it gets accepted.

I'm very torn on the upgrade path with a transitional keepassxc package, we can depend on keepassxc-minimal|keepassxc-full or the other way around.

Once we drop the transitional package is when things become nice: apt install keepassxc will tell you that there's a minimal and a full, and you can select it.

@stardust @tuxwise

11 May at 9:40 | Open on mastodon.social
Orca🌻 | 🏴🏳️‍⚧️

@juliank@mastodon.social
Sorry for the sudden request:
I hope that users that already have KeepassXC installed be transitioned to the full version. I don't want someone to woke up one day and found that their KeepassXC was upgraded to a minimin version (by themselves or automatically) without the feature they need. Newly installed users on the other hand can take some time to tinkering with their installation and figure it out.
Debian has been the OS that has least nasty suprise for decades, I hope it keeps this way.
❤️
@keepassxc@fosstodon.org @stardust@fosstodon.org @tuxwise@social.tchncs.de

@juliank@mastodon.social
Sorry for the sudden request:
I hope that users that already have KeepassXC installed be transitioned to the full version. I don't want someone to woke up one day and found that their KeepassXC was upgraded to a minimin version (by themselves or automatically) without the feature they need. Newly installed users on the other hand can take some time to tinkering with their installation and figure it out.
Debian has been the OS that has least nasty suprise for decades, I hope...

11 May at 9:53 | Open on nya.one
Team KeePassXC

@juliank @stardust @tuxwise That would certainly be much appreciated. Keep in mind that "keepassxc" refers to the full package in all other Linux distros and it's how we ship it ourselves for all platforms (including the PPA).

11 May at 12:36 | Open on fosstodon.org
Max Harmony

@juliank @keepassxc @stardust @tuxwise I don't think there's anything wrong with having a keepassxc-minimal option, but the keepassxc package should just be KeePassXC.

14 May at 22:58 | Open on mastodon.sdf.org
vv221
You cannot and should not expect these users to know about any obscure text files, let alone read and understand the tech babble that's in them.
Debian NEWS files are nothing like full changelog. They only document major changes that happen when upgrading from a Debian stable release to the next one.

The users do not have to hunt for this information, the content of the NEWS files is shown automatically during the upgrade.

Since these are targeting end users, they usually do not include "tech babble".

The only alternative to NEWS files that I can think of would be to never change anything from one Debian stable release to the next. Of course if Debian were to do that they would quickly lose all relevance as an operating system.

CC: @juliank@mastodon.social @stardust@fosstodon.org
You cannot and should not expect these users to know about any obscure text files, let alone read and understand the tech babble that's in them.
Debian NEWS files are nothing like full changelog. They only document major changes that happen when upgrading from a Debian stable release to the next one.
15 May at 15:39 | Open on fediverse.dotslashplay.it
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