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wakest ⁂
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wakest ⁂

"discussion always seems to lead straight into the same disastrous trap; a false dichotomy between the notions of centralization and decentralization. The vehemence with which this matter is debated is extraordinary, because the most cursory consideration of what constitutes a viable system reveals how false the dichotomy must be." - Stafford Beer, 1972

22 Jun 2023 at 12:43 | Open on social.wake.st
wakest ⁂

I finished listening to all 6 parts of Designing Freedom by Stafford Beer and god damn was a it good. I seriously recommend everyone to listen to the whole thing.

22 Jun 2023 at 15:15 | Open on social.wake.st
bhaugen

Thanks for the tip, @liaizon

monoskop.org/images/e/e3/Beer_

I read more of the part you quoted down-thread, about systems needing some centralized and some decentralized features. And I agree.

I have been pushing decentralization in several recent Fedi threads, but that's situational.

We started developing economic network software centralized, and then discovered the needs for network members to have their own agency. so some some decent. But also to be coordinated, so some cent.

@technology

Thanks for the tip, @liaizon

monoskop.org/images/e/e3/Beer_

I read more of the part you quoted down-thread, about systems needing some centralized and some decentralized features. And I agree.

I have been pushing decentralization in several recent Fedi threads, but that's situational.

23 Jun 2023 at 14:44 | Open on social.coop
wakest ⁂

@bhaugen @technology I think this point is really fascinating. The idea that really what is needed is a *balance* or equilibrium between centralization and decentralization and that is really whats being fought for.

23 Jun 2023 at 14:51 | Open on social.wake.st
bhaugen

@liaizon
Agreed. It would also be interesting to tease out some of the details in Fedi-related systems, as Stafford Beer does in his own systems.

That would be a longer conversation...

@technology

23 Jun 2023 at 14:54 | Open on social.coop
wakest ⁂

@bhaugen @technology I really highly recommend listening to Beer's whole lecture linked above if you have a spare 3 hours sometime. I would love to discuss it more, it feels very relevant to the current time

23 Jun 2023 at 15:00 | Open on social.wake.st
bhaugen

@liaizon 3 hours is hard to spare these days. Maybe we can pick away at them as bedtime podcasts, at the risk of falling asleep...

I'll read more of that text, though. I can speed-read to some extent, at least much faster than listening to somebody talk.

@technology

23 Jun 2023 at 15:08 | Open on social.coop
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